Nine: Finale Wild A❀❀ Guessing

Readers from 76 (!) countries of the world, what happens in the end?!

EE and my thoughts are below, but we missed a lot of things. What do you think?

As usual, I need to maintain my spoiler-free world, so if you have read about leaks from the production team, DO NOT SHARE!  This is for wild a❀❀ guessing only.

shouldersJomo:  I am rewatching 17 and 18, and not just for Shoulders-woo up there, to see if there are any remarkable clues to the end. I have NO idea!! Why DID the sticks in Choi’s hand disappear, if later Sun-woo was able to use one? WHY?

EE:  Yeah . . . I am really confused by that, too.

Jomo:  And who finds him? And how does he get back? Or does he?

EE:  I am worried that somehow time traveling Sun Woo has to die because he’s not connected to the Sun Woo from 1993.  HOWEVER… I suspect it is his body they find in the Himalayas. He survived the Choi incident and lived for 20 years.

Jomo:  Getting chills…Explain the body in the Himalayas. You think there will be a swap out where time traveling Sun Woo dies in his brother’s place?

EE:   Yeah, I think he ends up saving Hyung. Since they cremated the body it could be time traveling Sun Woo.

Jomo:  So what happens next in 2013? If time traveling Sun Woo doesn’t come back, who goes to his wedding? How does that work? (Do you like how I am making your do all the thinking?)

EE:  There is still the Sun Woo who has been there — like the Sun Woo we saw forced into a proposal was not time traveling Sun Woo.  That guy might be late . . . but he is still there.

waiting

Jomo:  So he catches up with himself?

EE:  Isn’t that usually the paradox with time travel, catching yourself?

Jomo:  You are right! I like that the idea that he might be late to the wedding, but is still there.

EE:   I am curious as to where Sun Woo was last seen in the current timeline around noon — like Min Young was getting ready for the wedding when she “leaped” into the timeline.

Jomo:   OK then – final thoughts:  Time traveling Sun Woo survives in the past, neutralizes Choi, but has to stay back. He ends up connecting with and working for Chul-min, but can only work behind the scenes at the news or he will completely confuse everyone when he ends up on TV at CBM.

cmcbmHe thinks for a little while about mentoring himself , but since he has already lived his own life decides it would be far too tempting to influence his decisions.

brothersInstead,  he takes off on a world tour, writing travel books under the pen name of Gyosu Du-gu to feed himself. His ultimate goal is to intercept his brother in the Himalayas and stop Hyung’s death.

EE:  There has to be something with the 8th stick (the one that vanished for Choi) and something with that box.  I just can’t figure it out yet.

Jomo:  Ooooh! Young-hoon finds it, goes back to the past, and gets a new wife afterall!  A quiet, shy, do anything for him girl who worships him.

EE: He deserves it.  ☺

happyyhninesticksD

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29 Responses to Nine: Finale Wild A❀❀ Guessing

  1. Requiem says:

    The 8th stick in Choi’s hands disappeared, because Sun Woo already used it. There still had to be 2 sticks since Sun Woo’s aunt took the container “before” Sun Woo used it. But in this universe you can only use each stick once in whatever timeline you’re on.

    Therefore the 8th stick was already “used up” so it burned up in Choi’s hands as if it could be used, it would be 10: 10 times travels instead of nine.

    As to what will happen in ep 19 and 20, I have absolutely no clue. I THINK there will be a happy ending, but I just don’t know if that’s the case. Particularly, since we have no clue really as to how the time traveling works, and why Sun Woo got stuck in the past.

    I just hope it isn’t as clunky as the phone-tool in Queen In-Hyun’s Man. If you’re going to define a way that time travel occurs, you need to give hints as to why it works. I don’t have to understand the hows and whats, but I need a why. There needs to be a reason why Sun Woo is stuck in the past. And if he somehow makes it back to his present, there needs to be a reasonable explanation for how he gets back.

    • jomo143 says:

      @Requiem –
      I added a diagram to see if that is what you mean.
      The number 8 stick that Choi tried to burn was actually the one Hyung found and that Sun-woo already used up?

      • Requiem says:

        Nope, number 8 is the stick that he uses when he gets the sticks back from his 1993 self. There were only 2 left in the burned up container, if you recall.

        And he uses it with his brother’s permission to try and tell Jung Woo to turn himself in during episode 13. But nothing changed. Since there were 2 sticks originally when the aunt takes them, for continuity there should be 2 sticks in the container that Choi re-discovers in 2013. However, since one of the sticks has already been used (it doesn’t matter the timeframe), it would be “cheating” for it to be used again. Hence, it just burns right up without any effect occurring.

        Does that make sense? Or have I muddied the waters again? 🙂

        Here’s a run down of the stick usage (not including the original one in Jung Woo’s hand which was used in Ep 3). There were 9 in the container.

        1) [Ep 4] 12/23/2012 – Goes to see his father, sees his brother and brings him back home.
        2) [Ep 4] 12/24/2012 – Leaves birthday card for Young Hoon to prove time travel.
        3) [Ep 4] 12/24/2012 – Visits record shop and tells Shi Ah to call his brother.
        4) [Ep 4] 12/24/2012 – Visits mom at movie theater and gives her necklace.
        [Ep 5] 12/24/1992 – Yoon Shi Ah calls Jung Woo about mom.
        12/24/2012 – Joo Min Young becomes Park Min Young.
        5) [Ep 7] 12/29/2012 – Goes back to prevent his father from getting killed. Installs cameras.
        6) [Ep 7] 12/30/2012 – Goes back to prevent his father from dying a second time, and sees Jung Woo as the cause. Chases Jung Woo for 30 minutes and as he catches him, disappears.
        7) [Ep 8] 12/30/2012 – Collects equipment and evidence of misdeeds. Leaves last 2 sticks in the past.
        [Ep 9] 12/31/1992 – Young Hoon finds Sun Woo’s brain tumor medicine, saving his life.
        [Ep 12] ~4/9/1993 – Incense sticks container returns with 2 incense sticks.
        8) [Ep 13] ~4/10/2013 – Contacts Jung Woo. Tells him to turn self in. Gives evidence to Jung Woo.
        [Ep 16] 4/23/1993 – Aunt takes the container with 2 incense sticks to give to the police investigator and indirectly to Choi.
        9) [Ep 16-17] 4/24/2013 – 5 min used by Choi to tell Park to attack 1993 Sun Woo. Sun Woo saves 1993 Sun Woo. Convinces Jung Woo to turn self in.

        Even though the history change occurred, making the 2 incense sticks appear to Choi, there seems to be a law of conservation of incense sticks where each incense stick can only be used once even if time changed things so that what previously occurred wouldn’t have happened.

        It’s been pretty consistent throughout the drama. For example, even though history has changed so much where the new 2012-13 Sun Woo wouldn’t have found the incense sticks, he still possesses them and has knowledge of how to use them. So, similarly even though history changed by removing the sticks from his grasp, since he’s already used the stick, it just acts of it’s already been used when Choi lights it up.

      • jomo143 says:

        @Requiem
        I think I understand.
        There will prolly not be any more traveling by stick in the last two eps. This is when the director pulls out something else – that has been right in front of us the whole time – to do something dramatic.
        ⇓⇓⇓⇓⇓⇓⇓⇓⇓⇓⇓⇓⇓⇓⇓⇓
        ALBUM COVER! Something something handwriting something something

        Bonus guess: Kevin Costner makes a cameo and delivers pizza to Min-young at the wedding, whispering, “He will always love you” in her ear.

      • EE says:

        @Requiem: my count has 2 and 3 on your list as the same one (however I am one stick short). I haven’t actually watched that episode over again so I could be wrong (especially since I am missing a stick) but I didn’t think Sun Woo spent an entire 30 minutes dropping off a card.

      • antoniazc says:

        i’m actually watching nine twice: 1) alone the same day the episode airs 2) with mom and sis 2 episodes per week (we’re in episode 12).
        I remember discusing the use of the sticks with them (they can’t understand how SW used the sticks so careless) and i have to agree with @Requiem: sticks 2 and 3 are different. Why did he spent a whole stick delivering a card??? i guess we’ll never know. My mom would said: another pd’s mistake!!!!

    • scifiwritir says:

      Requiem, you are soooooooooooo good!Thanks for the stick recap.

      • Requiem says:

        My pleasure.

        I’m glad others were able to gain something from this. I just wanted to share as I was curious myself about each stick use, and figured if I was going to do the work, others should be able to benefit also.

    • Delicatecloud says:

      Completely agree with your assessment. Moreover the two sticks in Choi’s drawer have been found by his minion as he have kept it in storage in 2013. He lit one and it disappeared becos it was already used by SW. There is no more sticks by my count!!
      The. Ending? Possible scenario – 2013 Sun Woo who is stuck in 1993 died and the 1993 Sun Woo, who have no memories of what happened will live on and meet MinYoung and gets to marry her. His brother will continue to be the doctor in China doing good works to compensate for his mistake of accidentally killing the man whom he called father. Afraid Mom will remain as she is – don’t think much can be developed in this story line. Twice SW tried to change the event but didn’t work. She is a one dimensional character unfortunately IMO.
      Second scenario – it is possible that the man who died in the Himalayas is Sun Woo who did not die in 1993 but was saved by young Young-hoon and went in search of more incense sticks so that he can return to the future!!! It took him 20 years and died in the process!
      Choi contined to be the half crazed guy in both scenarios kas his timeline either way would end that way.

      • scifiwritir says:

        I just know it’s going to be so obvious that we’ll all be groaning that we didn’t see it coming. I’m hoping it has to do with the phone call dying Sun Woo made to Dr Han back in the past. Maybe he will prevent himself from standing in the phone booth for so gosh-dang long. I just wish i knew why the incense stick didn’t work. That kinda came out of left field…and seemed just plain weird to me. Where is an expository monk when you need one?

  2. sally_b says:

    oh Fiddle-sticks ~ hahah.
    I actually have a stick of patchouli incense on my computer desk – I’m going to burn a bit of it while watching episode 19 tomorrow.

    I would use it as a prayer-stick that Sun Woo doesn’t die in that alleyway – but frankly, death and resurrection in this show don’t seem to have any absolutes – so maybe it’s the *correct* timeline in which future Sun Woo resolves and/or resets things by…um….dying.

    Though I think it’s a shame that the imminent death scene is not with O.O as the designated corpse …..because, personally, I find his evil character machinations overwrought in this show. There were plenty of avenues for angst and conflict without ALL of them being Choi ಠ_ಠ.

    For instance, the opportunity to exploit the free will of the persons living in the past – how many ways young Sun Woo could have screwed up older Sun Woo’s intentions. Or perhaps Min Young meets Sun Woo and *doesn’t* fall for him in the least. (Yeah…I know..that’s crazy talk)

    but, but…. it would have been more satisfying to me than Choi suddenly having the ability in ALL timelines to ‘steer the evil wheel’. His character has been far too prominent for me. blergh.
    ( /slightly disgruntled rant over.)

    I would not be adverse to some sort of quasi-universe-time-shift-free-float special effects – wherein Sun Woo, just as he dies in the past, is shot through an FX-portal into the future. Like the Terminator — fresh as a baby’s butt. hahaha! (I’ll remind you that your title is *Nine: Finale Wild A❀❀ Guessing* )

    see all of you tomorrow!

  3. anotheraddict says:

    Interesting theory about it being Sun Woo’s body in the Himalayas. Considering that not only was the body cremated, but the fingerprints had frozen off and the passport photo had magically disintegrated, that’s pretty much Dramaland code for: it wasn’t Hyung that died. I was hoping that it was Choi, but now that I think about it, Sun Woo#2 is a more logical candidate. Sun Woo’s first experience with the incense led to him being swallowed up by an avalanche, right?

    I’m as confused as you are about the sticks. I do know that they made a point of telling us in ep. 18 that Hyung is coming back from China this week, and I’d say it’s his turn to be the Hero. (Who else raised their eyebrow after Min Young’s mom asked if Hyung had ever married?)

    If I hadn’t seen QIHM, I’d be worried that this whole thing was the tumor talking, or all happening in Mom’s consciousness– some of the scenes lately, like the Harlem Shake (heehee) one, seem more like the stuff that dreams are made of. If there is a gotcha, I hope it’s a good one!

    Btw, what a cute pic of Young Hoon!

  4. jomo143 says:

    What about MOM?

  5. antoniazc says:

    congrats to you all for the hability to make guesses… i just can’t
    my head is a mess… i’m so nervous i give up trying to figure out what’s gonna happen
    i’m just trying to believe that everything will be ok… that i’ll have my happy ending
    of course i know they still have to explain the JW’s stick and why SW’s mother is like that, but i don’t know how (you’re making even more nervous with the thinking that is SW’s body at the Himalayas!)
    one thing is the JW’s original stick can’t be one of the 9 in the case, because then SW couldn’t have used it
    2 more epis and it’s finished…. i can’t wait for tonight!!!

  6. total_newbie_to_k says:

    I just learned, that there will be a several hours long power cut on Wednesday morning in the street I live. Wednesday morning is the moment the subbed ep 20 will be available in Germany. Thank you, electrical supply company, thank you so much!

  7. scifiwritir says:

    I just don’t see why we need to have the body in the Himalayas at all. I understand that there have been constants in all the time shifts: Dr Han’s icky wife, for instance. And I understand that Jung Woo did have the sticks in the first place (although he seems to have forgotten them in subsequent time shifts.) But generally a time shift means the alternate timeline totally stops existing (as far as we the viewers, Dr Han, Min Young, and Sun Woo are seeing.) So if the death on the Himalayas was in another timeline, why must we return to the Himalayas? Maybe Bro didn’t use it in this timeline because there was no guilt. And why exactly did Bro want to “make things go back to normal”? To rescue Mom? To not kill dad? To prevent Sun Woo from going back? To save Sun Woo from dying? Can both bros not be alive?

    • antoniazc says:

      Good point!!! never thought of that!!!!

    • anotheraddict says:

      More than anything, what makes me think that we have to revisit the Himalayas is that Show presented us with a mystery in the first three minutes. We saw Hyung, lying in the snow– barely conscious but clutching an incense stick with his bare hand. Then we hear crunchcrunchcrunch and see the shadow of someone standing over him. The next time we (allegedly) see Hyung, he’s dead– wearing the same red parka and still clutching the incense stick. If the mystery person who approached Hyung isn’t revealed in the finale, I’m gonna call “no fairsies”. Then again maybe it was a misdirect– I keep feeling like they’ve hinted that Mom and the necklace are gonna be important, but that could be a misdirect too.

      My inner Nancy Drew wishes there were time to rewatch all the episodes now, looking for more clues…

      • scifiwritir says:

        Would the mystery person be locals finding the body? But i’m definitely thinking the necklace is important. Going back to give mom the present saved Mom from being hurt by seeing her son lying to her because he had a date. A lot changed that night so who knows?

  8. cass says:

    I am so confused … I wanted to go back and watch all the previous episodes again but just didnt have time … so I am still not clear over timelines/how many incense sticks etc etc. I just hope we have a good resolution for our OTP or I shall feel very cheated come tomorrow. 😦

    • jomo143 says:

      Don’t worry. We are supposed to be confused.
      They have thrown so much stuff at us over the last 18, and have hidden stuff from us, that it all adds to the suspense.
      I like to guess no matter how completely wrong I have continually been in the past.
      It gives me a sense of false control over things. LOL

  9. Waiting says:

    All I have to say is I plan to watch the lasts episodes back to back…IF I can restrain myself [BIG if]. Too bad we can’t watch these as a group because the squee fest would be outrageous! lol

  10. sally_b says:

    (Edited for spoilers)

    For fun ~
    hmmmmm ….
    * Min Young says “Dammit…I’m going to a nunnery in the Himalayas — and pray for sticks!” …. at least 3/4 of a stick appears in some FX-mystical way ~ hopefully NOT clutched in the hand of a corpse on a rocky riverbank. She goes back 20 years to ensure the safety and future well-being of the *young Sun Woo* …..(evil O.O is still alive then …sadly) ….then waits for him to grow up — intending to meet him again — and start again. It’s actually past Sun Woo who gets the girl.

    * Bestest-Friend-Ever Dr. Han obtains the fragments and ashes left in the incense holder in Ep. 18 Sun Woo’s car. He applies every resource at his disposal, including Awesome-Surrogate-Father reporter/director Oh Chul Min to trace it’s origin and ultimately obtain …. at least …3/4 a stick — which again, is hopefully not being clutched by a ‘ completely-dead person’. (props to Monty Python)

    Being the HERO that he is….. he will either deduce a practical way to set things right OR being the moral man that he is…his endless appeals to the Heaven’s will be granted.
    (But not without a LOT of hair ruffling and teeth-gnashing, because he’s absurdly *cute* when he does that…go figure)

    * Mom.
    …will at last break, out of her catatonic state and remember that she bludgeoned Choi Jin-Cheol to death on the night he intended/tried to rape her…. was smart enough to escape detection, but slowly lost her mind after that.
    However — was still able to maintain appearances enough to marry Jung Woo & Sun Woo’s rich father …give birth to them and THEN ….fully ~ SPACE OUT. The entire story has been her hallucination.

    and ours.

    heheeee ~ Oh Nine. I just don’t know what you’ll do next. That’s your Charm.

  11. pinkblossom says:

    oh my gollies my brain is absolutely FRIED trying to keep up with all of everyone’s awesmatically spazztastic speculations! at this point, i’m SO willing to let the writers cheat in whatever way possible if they’ll just give me a happy ending. yes, i’m easy like that lol! 😀

  12. Berkshire Beanie says:

    OK, deep breath, I am going to brave watching it all again from the beginning so that when I finish the last 2 episodes should have aired and I can have my heart attack at the ending. It will be good. I just know it.

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